Gear list, opinions wanted

[Jim Gilchrist]

visiting 3 of our usual suspects.

Senator means drive up to Los Angeles and visit the media production sound equipment dealers located there.

An excellent idea I would also recommend put in your situation. Keep records of your mileage and expenses as trips like this are tax deductible.

Best regards,

Jim

[nyaudioguy]

Does anyone else distribute those Oscars lav's. their website is pretty archaic, no pricing, ordering etc. As far as the the ME-2's, I agree that they are a back up lavs at best. This guy here does a pretty good "Shoot-out" video comparing a few different ones.

The ME-2 was definitely the weakest, noticed some high end distortion on just basic dialogue. I can't imagine what would happen if he got his keys out. He also does a pretty good Windshield comparison using an industrial fan here:

http:// http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXujwO5y448

[RPSharman]

416 and 302.

I don't know how many times it needs to be said.

If you "can't afford" the 302, then wait until you are actually hired for your first job, pretend it's a freebie, and use the money earned as the cost difference between your FP33 and the 302.

I just don't get the concept of buying gear you don't really want.

Robert

[Colin Heath]

Im still thinking the rode ngt-3 is a solid starter mic. And you can find deals online where they give a discount on a blimp, or shock mount.

That rycote S kit looks solid too, for the price. No doubt its lighter. I may have to look into getting one.

I like how chads font for DEMO was the same style as finding nemo.... not sure why i noticed that.

Hope this works out for you. and hope to hear what your final choices are.

[Olle Sjostrom]

The s-series are fine, light. But thin, IMO. A breeze with stronger gusts can easily come through the fur. It's more like an engorged softie. And that big ring could be a bit annoying at times.

Other than that theyre great. Don't regret getting the rode blimp over the s-series though

[JonG]

Wexler wave is blowing out a lot of goodies right now such as wendt mixers and some wireless. I suggest calling them up and seeing what you can get on the cheap.

[VASI]

I like the sound of the Sennheiser MKH 416 off-axis and on-axis.

But I do not like the Rode NTG-3 off-axis.

[Marc Wielage]

Does anyone else distribute those Oscars lav's. their website is pretty archaic, no pricing, ordering etc.

The Oscar Sound Tech are first-class people. I've never had them take more than a day to get back to me in email (or through their website). I agree, the site is not fancy, but the consistency of their mikes and accessories is very good.

I also second the idea of getting a better mixer. I occasionally used the Shures in the 1980s on occasional gigs, and was never happy with the S/N ratio. I have no doubt the later ones got better, but the Sound Devices are really in a much higher class. My advice would be to try renting one for a day (or a weekend) and hear it for yourself. Also, the SD 442's are widely available used all over the place, since many people upgraded to the 552's. This is an extremely solid, flexible, well-made mixer that'll last for years.

--Marc W.

[Q]

You can save some money by getting good used gear. A used SD 302 goes for about $900 ... sometimes less if you shop around.

Also, consider the Sennheiser MKH 415 and 416t ... both as good as a new 416, but "T" power instead of 48v phantom. Shop around. I see the 415 go for $400 or less on occasion, and it's a GREAT sounding mic. The only issue you could have is that newer mixers can't power these mics, but the SD302 and the SD442 as well as the Wendt and PSC all provide "T" power.

[justanross]

416 and 302.

I don't know how many times it needs to be said.

If you "can't afford" the 302, then wait until you are actually hired for your first job, pretend it's a freebie, and use the money earned as the cost difference between your FP33 and the 302.

I just don't get the concept of buying gear you don't really want.

Robert

Word.

[nyaudioguy]

I never said I didn't "Want" an Fp-33, I just wanted opinions. I hear what you're saying though, I'm sure you've seen it out here all too many times, that exact situation. I am still curious what the specific downsides there is to the Shure mixer. Is it simply that once you've graduated to a higher end mixer, the thought of going back just seems that ridiculous? I am sure that once you ditch your Sentra for a Lexus, you get kinda spoiled, but at the time you were driving the Sentra, you were happy it was getting you from A to B and not in the shop all the time.

Part of my issue is that this is all a bit of a test run, I'm not at all sure this is a viable career choice, due to my geographic location, how much work there is out there, how much experience I have/don't have etc. If 6 months or a year from now things are going ok, I have no issue at all investing in some better equipment. Obviously buying a bunch of crap from day one will not work in my favor, so I need the "middle ground" gear. I seem to see a many more advertisements for location sound mixer than I do for Pro tools editors and mixers down here. I had a few opportunities years (And I mean YEARS) ago to do some ENG/EFP work, so it's not completely foreign to me, but I need to learn a lot. I have well trained ears after so many years of mixing in the studio, and I know what I like and don't like about a lot of the audio I've had to do post mixing with that I think this transition makes sense. but there's still the big "if" with the whole thing...... so there ya have it, hence my reluctance to just go all out right out of the gate.

[Rick Reineke]

Without repeating too much that's already been stated:

" The standard ME-2 Sennheisers are decent mics "

barely, IMHO... ' I agree w/ Senator

'The Oscar Sound Tech are first-class people.' I agree with Mark on this too.

Regarding the Shure mixer, I had an original FP-32 for years, traveled all over the world in some of worst conditions Imaginable, both climatic and social. Never had any problems with it and always got paid. (almost always, I did get stiffed once or twice, by unscrupulous producers) I don't re-call anyone saying, "That POS FP-32 is noisy."

The FP-33 is much quieter, probably still very rugged too.. IMO, if a good deal arose I'd get the FP33.

That being said, I use a 302.

.

[nyaudioguy]

Well with the back and forth equipment list, swapping out stuff here and there and negotiating, the sound

house I'm working with, the current cost of the FP-33 is actually down to 250.00, and she says it's in great condition

and had been qc'd to be in perfect working order by the in house guys who thoroughly inspect the consignment/used gear.

So the price does make it very attractive.

[studiomprd]

All the advice is good, and all the opinions are good subjective input.

Oscar has some of our usual suspects as dealers, and they are prompt, reliable folks with an exceptional value in a fine product. If your favorite suspect doesn't have what you want, deal with them directly, everyone has been happy!

Now, that mixer choice: For $250 grab that FP-33, that is expendables money, and you'll always have that as a utility or back-up unit. At $500, I'd start reconsidering (new or used) an SD 302, or looking for a smokin' good deal on a Wendt, which are excellent products particularly popular in reality work where they are valued for simplicity, good performance, and ruggedness-reliability.

Your Sentra vs Lexus analogy hit the mark directly! Also what Rick R said. Sure, the SD have better spec's and features (the SD folks came from Shure where they had been designing.... Shure mixers! Which would I rather have or prefer to use ?? but for the price you are paying you will be listing that as your best deal in another thread! I wouldn't sell you either of my (working fine, thank you) FP-33's that cheaply!! -- even though I rarely use them myself these days.

Also, the tip on looking for sell offs of used rental gear is a good one, but be more careful (I'd suggest you ask for a 14 day return or exchange privilege giving you a test drive period) Sometimes these folks are just freshening up their inventory, sometimes it is about tax strategy, but sometimes they are dumping stuff just as it is turning problematic.(BTW, this is about the same thing as buying used cars from the car rental giants, which lots of folks swear by, others swear at)

[John Blankenship]

While purchasing decisions can only be made properly by the individual, when it comes to advice there's much to be learned, and things to consider, by listening to feedback such as given here.

On your decision, I'm with RPS. If you want someone else to make the choice for you about a starting package, then the best advice is simply what Robert said: a 302 and a 416. While there are many, many other things to be taken into account as you grow, there is much you need to have learned in order to make your decisions.

So, this is starter package advice to someone who doesn't know what they're doing. If you want to start out with quality professional gear on a limited budget and you want someone else to tell you your best bang for the buck with that stipulation, then 302/406. How you need to grow from there is what you learn as a professional.

This can be stated as a corollary to the boat buying axiom of, "If you have to ask how much then you can't afford it." In this case, "If you have to ask what to buy, then you're not ready to use it." In both cases, once you make the purchase, you'll certainly start learning.

[studiomprd]

" "If you have to ask what to buy, then you're not ready to use it." "

Ausgeschneichtsnichs

You say you did your homework, and came up with the list, now you want us to tell you it is OK to buy what you want ??

It is OK to buy whatever you want.

that is my opinion.

Edited December 2, 2011 by studiomprd

[nyaudioguy]

Well the list wasn't necessarily a list I put together from extensive research. I was inquiring about used mixers from one of the consignment dealers online and there was a full ENG package for sale on one of them, I do believe I saw it out here as well. From the photos I could not determine the exact make and model of all the gear so I inquired. She came back and said it was sold, but that she'd be glad to put together a quote based on my basic needs and "Approximate" budget (yes that is a slippery slope, I know)

so she put together a list some of it was perfectly reasonable and other aspects left me wanting for more info and opinions.

I am not just asking what to buy per se. The expression John B. relayed is pretty accurate, if that is in fact the case, and in some respects it's like one of my favorite original quotes, which is something to the effect of "Tiger woods will kick your ass at golf using a walking stick and a putter" meaning Technique and experience counts for a LOT. In this business that is certainly true though shitty gear will present some obvious obstacles. But the best gear in the hands of an amateur will yield likely results, I do know that. So I am relying on my common sense, my "current" audio background and expertise, your helpful comments and opinions and a healthy dose of educating myself on stats, specs and direct comparisons (like the Mic, Lav and windshield shootouts I posted) this for instance is an excellent tool for someone in my shoes. There are as many opinions as there are people with a pulse, but nothing compares to direct comparison. Unfortunately I don't have access to all the gear I want to compare, so I watch these. I wish there were more like it.

[studiomprd]

" other aspects left me wanting for more info and opinions. "

and asking here is fine, but to fully appreciate the answers you get, especially the opinions, you really ought to do more of your own homework. (For example on this forum you notice a lot of negativity toward the FP-33 --how could you miss it?

I understand it, but really believe it is a capable piece of kit, and for $250, practically a throw-away, as I said: expendable. If I didn't have a couple, I'd probably grab at one as you describe it.

Chad-Fish has done some nice comparisons, they may be a bit limited. in scope as well as, perhaps, quality. When one wants to be an "audio snob", comparing MP-3's has discernible limitations over comparing 16/48 .wav's, ir 24/96 .wav's which are marginally even better in detectable quality.

And thanks for my new shorthand: <TIGER> will now replace my archery Senatorium!

[nyaudioguy]

Well Mike, you lost me with the "And thanks for my new shorthand: <TIGER> will now replace my archery Senatorium!"

But I hear ya on the rest of it, and OH yeah loud and clear on the negativity on the FP mixer, but as a starter mixer and eventually as a spare/extra at 250.00 bucks it's a no brainer. Don't even get me started on the 44.1/16, 48/16, 96/24 debate, I have some strong opinions on that one.

[studiomprd]

" on the 44.1/16, 48/16, 96/24 debate, I have some strong opinions on that one. "

that has, of course, been discussed, and while nothing has really changed, I'm sure it will be discussed further...

" <TIGER> will now replace my archery Senatorium "

Our host has asked me not to keep using my admonition that: It is not about the arrows, it is about the archer. You stated it quite well and just as I use <HAT> to say: contact the manufacturer, I'll use <TIGER> to mean: it is not about the clubs and balls, it is about the golfer

[nyaudioguy]

Ahhh, gotcha, makes sense now. Glad I could be of service like that. You can feel free to quote me every time you use said expression and I'll take some of the heat when everyone get's sick of that saying too.