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sending scratch feed to 5d (again)


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Okay so i m on a shoot today with a 5d camera. Commercial work with no video assist guy. I d like to send scratch feed to 5d to get okay sound for playback in hdmi monitor speaker. Try plugging my erx with standard 1/8" stereo jack cable sending tone and camera stays on camera mic? Tried switching cable, tried switching to a g2. Made sure i was plugged into mic input (not video output plug duh) on camera. It seems like camera doesnt get that there is something plugged. It always stays on camera mic no matter what i do or plug in mic plug? Am i missing something here? Is camera jack just busted? Thanks!

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I own a Canon 5D MKii and I send it sound from my 788T via a G2 Tx and Rx set.

On the Canon, you go to Menu - Tools - Live View&Movie Settings - Sound Recording - Set to 'Manual'

With this setting activated AND a 3.5mm (is that what you Americans call 1/8" ?) stereo jack in the Mic Input - it disables the internal mic.

BTW - The mic input of the 5D is extremely sensitive. With zero level tone hitting the Rx, I have the camera mic input '2 clicks' above off to get the tone hitting the right levels

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The Canon EOS-5D manual is not the most intuitive out there. The switching is "supposed" to be automatic:

Canon5Daudio-1.png?t=1353035527

Manual at this link:

http://www.usa.canon...huresAndManuals

I agree with Whitney: scratch track only. Just say no to recording primary audio on toy cameras. (And in fairness to Canon, the 5D and 7D can make OK 1080 HD pictures, in the right hands.)

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" .....in america. "

I confess...

I thought about that ...

so in EU, you refer to the male connectors on cable as jacks ??

yep - over here a jack or a plug or a jackplug......goes into a socket

I guess the terms change around the world......here in the UK we are also in a generation of transition from Imperial to metric and so things get more confusing .......I think in terms of XLR, we normally refer to male or female ends (not plugs or sockets), however, in terms of a guitar lead, we always use 1/4" (never metric measurements), but for minijack/ipod etc we always use 3.5mm (never imperial measurements)

we buy petrol in litres, but calculate efficiency in MPG, we buy food in KGs and eat ¼ pounders, beer in pints and vodka in Litres...….etc

anyway - getting of topic....my answer to the topic "Is the Canon 5D is capable of recording a good 'scratch track' for your project ?"- If that's what the customer wants then give it to them, but I'd tell them that personally I WOULD NOT use it for a final mix as Canon's internal mic AGC cannot be disabled and is hissy and it pumps audibly on critical listening.

If production INSIST on doing this, then there is a work around I use on my own 5D. I have installed Magic Lantern firmware (a freeshare project not approved offically by Canon) onto my CF cards. This is NOT permanently uploaded to the camera but remains on the card. You can do the research yourself, but the massive benefits are

1) It allows the AGC to be switched off

2) It gives you audio metering on the video screen

3) It allows you to plug your 3.5mm headphone jack (insert whichever international translation required ) straight into the A/V out to monitor the audio.

Obviously, this is not practical if you turn up on a shoot on the day and ask production to turn over their CF cards for you to pre-format. Not your job! - but, if you are in paid prep for a job that insists on a workflow that gives a Production mix on 5D - then I can recommend this as viable solution. MAKE SURE production are aware of the fact that Magic Lantern ALSO gives them visual benefits (zebra peaking etc….), but WILL change the menu systems seen by the operator.

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yep - over here a jack or a plug or a jackplug......goes into a socket

I guess the terms change around the world......here in the UK we are also in a generation of transition from Imperial to metric and so things get more confusing .......I think in terms of XLR, we normally refer to male or female ends (not plugs or sockets), however, in terms of a guitar lead, we always use 1/4" (never metric measurements), but for minijack/ipod etc we always use 3.5mm (never imperial measurements)

we buy petrol in litres, but calculate efficiency in MPG, we buy food in KGs and eat ¼ pounders, beer in pints and vodka in Litres...….etc

anyway - getting of topic....my answer to the topic "Is the Canon 5D is capable of recording a good 'scratch track' for your project ?"- If that's what the customer wants then give it to them, but I'd tell them that personally I WOULD NOT use it for a final mix as Canon's internal mic AGC cannot be disabled and is hissy and it pumps audibly on critical listening.

If production INSIST on doing this, then there is a work around I use on my own 5D. I have installed Magic Lantern firmware (a freeshare project not approved offically by Canon) onto my CF cards. This is NOT permanently uploaded to the camera but remains on the card. You can do the research yourself, but the massive benefits are

1) It allows the AGC to be switched off

2) It gives you audio metering on the video screen

3) It allows you to plug your 3.5mm headphone jack (insert whichever international translation required ) straight into the A/V out to monitor the audio.

Obviously, this is not practical if you turn up on a shoot on the day and ask production to turn over their CF cards for you to pre-format. Not your job! - but, if you are in paid prep for a job that insists on a workflow that gives a Production mix on 5D - then I can recommend this as viable solution. MAKE SURE production are aware of the fact that Magic Lantern ALSO gives them visual benefits (zebra peaking etc….), but WILL change the menu systems seen by the operator.

Wow i didn t know u could do that especially using the av jack as a confidence return.. I know a lot of one man band camera people that would love these audio features on their 5d's. ( and not having to buy a mark III as a matter of fact).

the current software for 5d s does allow you to disable the agc when u set up audio to manual.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Just to add to the people that it works for, I do send a scratch track to both 5D's and 7D's regularly (even a Ti of some sort once) and haven't had much of a problem. But like others have said, have to be set on the manual and it's very easy to overdrive, so leave the levels low.

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I send scratch mix mic level audio to the cam via G2 and put the cam audio in automatic. Result: nice fat waveforms for PluralEyes or etc syncing, no clipping of the audio, massively compressed audio recording that is audible on the tiny built-in speaker for a quick playback, and recorded audio that's great as a syncing guide track and useless for anything else.

philp

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  • 4 weeks later...

Philip, that's a great idea. I acually did that once, too, but without putting much thought into it. I just wanted to send a scratch track to cam for playback and didn't care much about compression.

In fact the G2's were adding their own heavy limiting and companding so the scratch track was all but unusable except for instant playback.

During production one of the producers came up to me and said they had noticed in the editing suite just ever so slightly compression on the audio. He asked me if I could do without that. I thought wtf, but explained to him that there was in fact only heavy compression on the scratch track, (but non on the production audio) and that this wasn't the audio they were supposed to use. He mumbled something and left (he was a bit of a weirdo). The editor later told me, he had indeed been cutting with the scratch track.

Now I will alwys do it like that, so there's not chance they'll ever use the scratch track.

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" Now I will alwys do it like that, so there's not chance they'll ever use the scratch track. "

or,

they will decide your audio (on the camera) isn't good enough, and never call you again.

you cannot tell the producer what to do (of course we can, and do, suggest, but these amateurs have unreasonable expectations, remember?

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