Recording good sound in noisy environments

[Sebben]

No way. I will try all of the offered suggestions in the field when it makes sense for the situation.

I think that was totally unnecessary comment.

I get the impression that some people like hammering away at the inexperienced between gigs to pass the time.

[studiomprd]

" I'm the JB you're speaking about, "

" I just assume that the recording starts with the microphone "

not good to 'ass u me'...

I get that you are not really a sound person, but a movie-maker who wants good sound, but thinks it is just plug'n play if you have the proper toys. (That's what JB also seems to have picked up on)

you really need to do some reading (Jay Rose's books at www.dplay.com are a good start).

and what's with the constantly changing avatar ??

[Sebben]

Correct mostly. However, I am very much aware that it is not a plug and play solution and not expecting that.

So I would appreciate it if we can get past that and focus on techniques and tools that can make a difference in a nosey environment.

Meanwhile, I will continue to read and research, and see if any of it relevant to the situations that I am working in.

Thanks for your time.

[studiomprd]

" on techniques and tools that can make a difference in a nosey environment. "

we have all been telling you this stuff...

it is physics, especially acoustics...

signal to noise ratio... and reducing reflections.

[Christian Spaeth]

I get the impression that some people like hammering away at the inexperienced between gigs to pass the time.

there is some truth to that. though sometimes it is justified.

and what's with the constantly changing avatar ??

talking to yourself, mike?

[glenn]

I would suggest that our Nomad feature neverclip is part of your solution. When recording in noisy environments it is common to hit the limiter on the recorder. When you do so you limit the dynamic range and push the desired audio into the ambient noise. Never clip prevents this by eliminating the limiter. The result is a much more natural sound and extra dynamic range that would be lost to the limiter action. To best utilize this function you would need to use a hardwire mic and not a radio mic. The result can easily be an extra 6-12 dB of additional dynamic range.

Please listen to the neverclip demo on the Zaxcom web site to hear the effect.

Glenn

[Constantin]

Not sure I would entirely agree with that, Glenn.

The OP mentioned filming people in their natural habitats and workplaces. This doesn't really sound like many sudden spikes in volume are to be expected. If it's constant background noise, it's easy to set up any recorder appropriately. I don't think s/n ratio of the recorder would make much of a difference here. The signal to background-noise ratio is what's important here. I doubt neverclip has any influence on that

[Jeff Wexler]

Constantin is right, Neverclip would not be a significant factor in reducing unwanted background in noisy environment. The best solutions are those which have already been suggested: first and foremost, try to pick a location that is not so noisy, try and treat the noisy location, physically, to reduce ambient background noise; then, choose a directional microphone if by its use you can get it close to the subject (voice) and use directional characteristics of microphone to reduce background noise; use a lavaliere microphone that you will be able to place close (proximity) to your subject (voice) thereby reducing noisy background.

[John Blankenship]

I hesitate to weigh back in on the subject since you seem to prefer a kid glove treatment and my inclinations are to be direct.

Early in the thread I (and many others) offered a succinct response that garnered little attention, rather you continued to ask the same question. I've seen you make no references to anything you've learned from the many past threads we've tried to steer you toward, nor have you asked any questions that would elevate the discussion beyond those past threads, rather you continue to retread the same ground, hence my earlier comment that you seem, "more interested in talking about the subject than in learning about the subject."

However, in the hopes that you're sincere about learning to make compelling documentaries...:

I've worked on many documentaries as a sound mixer, behind the camera, and in post production. If you wish to create a doc that uses both picture and sound that collaborate to immerse the viewer into the story, your best bet by far is to hire an experienced sound mixer -- one who has experience with documentary production. It's important to hire the right person, though. A sound mixer whose body of work is primarily corporate, for instance, has a different esthetic than one who understands the need to include environment as part of the soundscape.

If it were me, for instance, I'd use a combination of boom and lavs, often both at the same time, understanding, of course, that if post isn't up to speed on the esthetic of the piece, they could easily misuse those sonic elements. Post should also be on board in all aspects of the sonic landscape that you're serving and how it informs the reality of the work.

Simply asking for advice on "what microphone to use" tells me you're likely not at that stage in your career, yet, but it would be helpful for your growth to understand what's involved in creating the most compelling documentaries.

To do so, look beyond microphones and ask yourself what affect you wish each story to have on an audience. Start from the artistic esthetic and let that inform your subsequent decisions.

Good documentaries are about engaging your viewer, not about purity of any one element.

[JWL]

Here here!