DonSpaulding Posted September 26, 2009 Report Share Posted September 26, 2009 Hello to all at this forum and Thanks to Jeff for helping me get this set up. Most of my business involves recording orchestra and jazz concerts. However, I wish to expand other avenues of the business. I have a 702 and am looking for a wireless lav. Is there anything under $1,000 that will sound decent and be an alternative to the latest lectrosonics (411)? Or should I pick up an older 195 off Ebay? Thanks in advance! Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProSound Posted September 26, 2009 Report Share Posted September 26, 2009 Buying a used 211 or 201 Lectrosonics system for around $1200 is your best bed via this forum ebay or the used gear pages of many audio retails like TREW , Gotham, Pro-sound. Or you can buy some Sennheiser G2 Wireless for under $600.00 new see link for info on G2 Wireless http://www.trewaudio.com/store/product.php?productid=709&cat=77&page=1 I would buy a used 201 or 211 system though if I was you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justanross Posted September 26, 2009 Report Share Posted September 26, 2009 Nothing is better then Lectro wireless. You can check out the used sections of websites like, www.trewaudio.ca, www.coffeysound.com or gothamsound.com. You can usually find a good deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Ragon Posted September 26, 2009 Report Share Posted September 26, 2009 Nothing is better then Lectro wireless. You can check out the used sections of websites like, www.trewaudio.ca, www.coffeysound.com or gothamsound.com. You can usually find a good deal. Personally, I'm a Lectro guy too.. but some would disagree here with your statement. In fact, several prominent mixers that I know don't like Lectro. They might also look into Sennheiser and Sure wireless equipment too. I would stay away from Azden though.. -Richard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted September 26, 2009 Report Share Posted September 26, 2009 Each term I demonstrate to my class a Lectro 400 system (with countryman or Sanken lav) and a Senn G2 system (incl the supplied mic); the demo is blind -they listen on headphones but don't know which system they are hearing, as I hold the two lav's together in my hand, or have them clipped together on my person. sure, they notice the systems sound different, but they both sound fine while I'm talking, and the preferences are mixed, and they agree that either one sounds fine for making their movies. that all changes when I pull out my keys... the rule is: Generally speaking, you get what you pay for. so: what are your needs?? and BTW, Shure and AT (among others!) also make excellent products for PA and recording that are hugely popular with performers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Wexler Posted September 26, 2009 Report Share Posted September 26, 2009 Personally, I'm a Lectro guy too.. but some would disagree here with your statement. In fact, several prominent mixers that I know don't like Lectro. I like Lectrosonics, the products, the company, the people, but I prefer the Zaxcom units I have been using for the last several years --- audio quality and features not available from any other company, things that I have come to rely on and would miss were I to use any other wireless. That said, if you are looking for reliable used wireless gear, you will find many more choices with Lectro product and you are almost assured you will have good performance and good support --- Lectro has a huge installed base of users and have an excellent line up of gear. Regards, Jeff Wexler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonSpaulding Posted September 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 26, 2009 Thanks for the feedback. I agree that Lectro is top notch, but I wouldn't be using it daily, maybe only once a week. What I should have asked, is what's the best of the "B" stuff. Something that will sound pretty good, but maybe isn't as durable. There seems to a couple 195's on Ebay, what's your thoughts on these or should I seek out the 201 or 210? Please remember I can't spend over a grand! I don't have the clients who will pay for Lectro quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProSound Posted September 27, 2009 Report Share Posted September 27, 2009 I don't have the clients who will pay for Lectro quality. What will your clients pay? most of us get $50.00 per lectrosonics wireless a day. Pro-Sound in NYC 1-800.883.1033 has 3 lectrosonics 201 systems in block 21 for sale listed at $1300.00 trust me spend the extra $1300.00 my 200 series lectros have over 800 days of use on them and always preform 100 percent of the time call Pro-sound monday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonSpaulding Posted September 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2009 Pro-Sound in NYC 1-800.883.1033 has 3 lectrosonics 201 systems in block 21 for sale listed at $1300.00 trust me spend the extra $1300.00 my 200 series lectros have over 800 days of use on them and always preform 100 percent of the time call Pro-sound monday. Thanks Whitney! Will do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted September 27, 2009 Report Share Posted September 27, 2009 When my clients come to me and ask what wireless system they should buy to work with their mini camcorder on their one-man-band shoot in Bolivia etc, I usually tell them to buy Senn G2s anymore. The form factor and accessories work better for them than Lectro 100s, and they are usually put off by the price, size and complexity of used Lectros like 210D or 211 (205s and 200s are out because of no internal batts). For a working sound person w/o much money, I would say the situation is exactly reversed--go for the older Lectro stuff used instead of new cheap Senns. Philip Perkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonSpaulding Posted September 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 that all changes when I pull out my keys... the rule is: Generally speaking, you get what you pay for. so: what are your needs?? Just like in the studio, keys put mics in their place. My needs are quite basic. There are times when I have to record lectures or help out a video crew with a talking head. I don't even own a recorder with TC (only a SD702), so I'm assuming I won't be doing any (high end) film work. A used ($500) 195 would be spot on as far as budget goes, but would the 195 sound better than the new G2? Mr. Perkins, good to see you here in addition to GS - thanks for your advice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmassey Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 YES....a used 195 will sound better than a G2, and have less chance of RF dropouts. But if your situation needs something that is frequency agile, tuneable, the 200 series would be right for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 As usual, Philip outlined it nicely. Some observations and comments: I'm surprised how good the reception is on G2 systems, considering that they're not diversity. I'm impressed by how good the sound quality on the G2 systems is for the price. But the Lectros are definitely better on both counts. For pro work you want pro gear. If you watch carefully, you'll see used 210D systems occasionally go on eBay for well under a grand. Used 201 systems sometimes go for from under a grand to $1,300. Buying from the consignment pages of an established location sound company will add a bit to the price but also can add some quality assurance and accountability. I would recommend a used Lectro 201, 210, or 211 system if sound quality and dependable reception are priorities. They all pull fairly low current and can use internal batteries. A 205 receiver pulls twice the current of a 210, and a 200 pulls four times the current of a 210, and neither the 205 nor 200 can use internal batteries. Good luck. John B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 YES....a used 195 will sound better than a G2, and have less chance of RF dropouts. But if your situation needs something that is frequency agile, tuneable, the 200 series would be right for you. I still have a 195D, and don't think the RF is quite as solid as the later 200 series stuff. Re the G2, sound wise they might be close but the 195 (if it is a "D" version) is diversity and the G2s are not--so better range and fewer dropouts, maybe less distortion. Most people I recommend G2s to, and the way I use them myself, is for VERY short hops--talent to cam with the talent right in front of the camera--like no more than about 25 feet. One bugaboo w/ 195 and 200/205 (as mentioned above) is that they pull a lot of juice--210Ds were a big improvement in that regard and Lectro has been reducing the RX power consumption on each new model ever since. The 200s are REALLY brutal on batteries. Philip Perkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 what is better, and what sounds better be very subjective... G2's have been discontinued, and may not be as easy to find (new), G3's cost a bit more, but are diversity portables (G2's have diversity RX's available, but they aren't the pack type. Used Lectro's are also great values, but you should perform your own tests to see if you can find a significant difference in the performance that will affect your situations when using them. Frequency agility is a good thing! so many choices... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Perkins Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 what is better, and what sounds better be very subjective... G2's are discontinued, and may not be as easy to find, G3's cost a bit more, but are diversity portables (G2's have diversity RX's but they aren't the pack type. Used Lectro's are also great values, but you should perform your own tests to see if you can find a significant difference in the performance that will affect your situations when using them. Frequency agility is a good thing! so many choices... There are still plenty of G2s around at good prices--check EBAY or etc, we just bought another one with no trouble. In wirelesses you get what you pay for, and huge strides have been made in recent years. Meanwhile indie doco filmmakers have less money to spend than ever, so they buy G2s and we do the best we can with their audio in post.... Philip Perkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Joachim Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 The new Sennheiser G3 portable systems are now diversity, using the lav mic as the second antenna. Another good choice at that same price point ($500.00) is the Sony UWP system. We have had great success with them. Whitney forgot to mention us (LSC) along with the other fine retailers as a possible resource for new and used gear. Thanks SJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 The new Sennheiser G3 portable systems are now diversity, using the lav mic as the second antenna. Okay, Steve, you have me really puzzled. Since the receiver is what benefits from diversity reception... and most of us plug the mic into the transmitter... exactly how does what you described work? Inquiring minds are bewildered. John B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt McGowin Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 I think Steve meant to say that The xlr output cable on the rx is used as another antenna to achieve diversity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmassey Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Yea, only it is not XLR!!! Mini plug cable out of the receiver acts as the second antenna for diversity operation. Phillip, when you say you do the best you can with what you get, what have been some of the problems. The G2 and G3 systems are pretty darn good for the price, yes, they won't pass the key jingling test, but 90% of the docs and shooters with BURRITO CAMS, hand me their transmitters and say it has worked well for them in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt McGowin Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 "Yea, only it is not XLR!!!" Yes these small receivers have a locking mini stereo output. the cable output is xlr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Actually, if they're packaged the same as the G2, you're both right. The receiver's output is a 3-conductor mini jack and they come with a cable terminated with a miniplug for use with smaller camcorders and also an XLR terminated cable. John B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Joachim Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Oops. Meant to type "output Cable" instead of "lav Mic". Brain fart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 tough house... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petros Kolyvas Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 I'm looking for a used wireless setup. We have, in the past, rented Lectro systems and our main rental house carries old 187 and 190/195 (non-D) systems. I've always been impressed with the quality and reliability so I started looking at a used 195 diversity system to start. With a Lav mic and no plug-on transmitter it would be roughly the same cost as a similar Senn 100 G3 system. I like the idea that we'd be getting a known quantity with the 195D, even if some of that knowledge is of the system's shortcomings. Ideally we'd love to eventually get a 400-series lectro setup, but we spend more time with the boom than wireless mics, so this would be for added coverage or situations where the boom simply isn't feasible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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