If you were buying new wireless today...

[Jon Mendel Sound]

Hey all. First time poster, long time reader! I've always used FB channels for communication but figured I'd get on here finally. For my first post I wanted to ask if anyone had keen opinions if you were starting over with new wireless what would you get? (but still using SD 8 series mixers)

 

I wish to have digital RF, AES output, and remote control on the tx. Since I am an SD user, this leaves Shure or SD. Zaxcom clearly answers my needs but sticking with SD for now. 888 user. 

 

So, that begs the question, with the new SD tx out, I am super curious about performance and sound quality between these two systems. I suppose we have to wait for feedback as they just hit the street.

 

8 channels of Axient is about $6000 cheaper. And the rf performance I've heard is stellar. Curious about SD/nexus performance. Higher price point for better integration. Decisions. Thanks all. 

 

[codyman]

I guess it comes down to what do you do mostly in the sound world?  Sports?  ENG?  Documentary?  etc.  The nexus is the new kid on the block.  Axient is very widely used in the sports world.  Both work great in terms of range.  If you do narrative, I'd say the pack sizes (particularly the mini) of the Sound Devices is easier to hide.  If pack size isn't as big of a concern, then you'd be able to get away with either really.  I'd recommend renting each system and trying it out in the real world before putting down a new vehicle's worth of cash though.

[carbonhobbit]

Ask mixers in your area the same question. If most have brand x and you are leaning toward brand y, just know they won't be able to help you out if you are in a bind and need a replacement fast. Also check out how easy it is to rent equipment and check if brand y is rentable when most rental houses have brand x. Just a few more thing to think about when buying. But if you really like everything about brand y, then go ahead and buy brand y. And saving money isn't always the best option in the sound world. Better to buy once than by again and again.

 

[glenn]

Hi Joe: There are many customers that use Zaxcom wireless with Sound Devices and other manufacturers recorders so I would hope you would be open to consider the big picture of the sound bag and your work. A RX8 with CL5 camera link is a great way to get into the system with a non Zaxcom recorder.  Transmitter size, battery life,  transmission reliability when used in reflective environments (Like in cars, brick walls or around metal objects), cost, transmitter pre-amp gain control, recording transmitters, continuous tuning receiver front end agility, transmitter wireless replay and re-record to name a few things that are highlights of our system. There are a few choices out there and many factors to consider.  If you were to consider Nova then you only need the Nova, MRX414 receivers and transmitters. This would still be a great value for a sound bag that would be half the size, weight, power consumption and cost of competitive products. I get the fact that the integration with Nova is a big advantage of our system. Using it with a non-Zaxcom recorder does not negate the bulk of the systems advantages. It is important to think about the flexibility of 4 channel plug in receivers that are easily used in the Nova  RX8, RX4 or RX12 in terms of return on investment and not keeping all your eggs in one basket. 

[tourtelot]

Come on man.  Take the advertising to Manufacturers and Dealers.  Bad behavior.

 

D.

[Doc Justice]

I personally believe that the offerings from our favorite wireless brands have gotten so feature rich and so reliable that there is no "wrong" answer.

 

But the mantra I preach is that choosing a wireless system is about choosing which compromises you are comfortable with.

 

Each company has different philosophies and workflows and quirks. If you're able to, get hands on with the ones that you're interested in (and one or two that you don't think you're interested in) so that you can learn the ins and outs and get a feel for what you'll be missing if you decide on a different system. Minimize FOMO and minimize regrets!

[Philip Perkins]

I'd be interested to know if any sound folks here working in drama or docs are using Axient (or other Shure) these days?  Where I live it is all Lectro, Zax and a few Wisy, with the solo-shooters using low-end Senn G4 or the Blutooth stuff.  I like Shure, but what with diffs in mic connectors etc it's hard to change horses.

 

[codyman]

1 minute ago, Philip Perkins said:

I'd be interested to know if any sound folks here working in drama or docs are using Axient (or other Shure) these days?  Where I live it is all Lectro, Zax and a few Wisy, with the solo-shooters using low-end Senn G4 or the Blutooth stuff.  I like Shure, but what with diffs in mic connectors etc it's hard to change horses.

 

I'd bet LA is a Lectro town overall if you did a poll.  At least that's been my experience here and with most the other mixers I work with.  Sports definitely use Shure and so do a lot of venues.  The nice thing about people mostly using Lectro here is that I can always source more channels / accessories etc. in a heartbeat.

[The Documentary Sound Guy]

I've been curious about Axiant for a while, but I've never seen it in the wild.  Vancouver is definitely a Lectro town ... I just got a Nova & Zaxcom wireless, and I have mixers asking me about it because nobody else has it.

[Philip Perkins]

I work a lot in live-show sound anymore, and the installed base I've run into in the USA is heavily Shure (although not necessarily Axient unless it is a high-end venue), and those that aren't Shure are Sennheiser, at least so far, as are the Euro halls.  It doesn't seem like the diffs in price are that great, and even in smaller markets there are often rentable Shure wireless (but not with "baggable" RX) when there are no Lectro/Zax etc rentals available except from individuals.

[glenn]

Codyman: Since the original poster specifically said he was looking for digital transmission wireless I think that makes how many people have companded fm analog wireless from Lectro a non factor. In terms of digital wireless Zaxcom had been selling it for over 20 years. So I know there is a lot of it out there all over the US. In LA Trew audio and Audio department have rental stock. I do not see who has sold the most as a deciding factor. If you have seen some of the polls on Doc’s Strictly Sound group Zaxcom is a leader in Sales of Digital wireless. We are also big in sports as we have gear in every NFL game. 

[codyman]

2 minutes ago, glenn said:

Codyman: Since the original poster specifically said he was looking for digital transmission wireless I think that makes how many people have companded fm analog wireless from Lectro a non factor. In terms of digital wireless Zaxcom had been selling it for over 20 years. So I know there is a lot of it out there all over the US. In LA Trew audio and Audio department have rental stock. I do not see who has sold the most as a deciding factor. If you have seen some of the polls on Doc’s Strictly Sound group Zaxcom is a leader in Sales of Digital wireless. We are also big in sports as we have gear in every NFL game. 

"Cool"

[Wyatt Tuzo]

1 hour ago, Philip Perkins said:

I'd be interested to know if any sound folks here working in drama or docs are using Axient (or other Shure) these days?  Where I live it is all Lectro, Zax and a few Wisy, with the solo-shooters using low-end Senn G4 or the Blutooth stuff.  I like Shure, but what with diffs in mic connectors etc it's hard to change horses.

 

 

I would guess that there are maybe 10 or so (myself included) narrative mixers here in NYC who are using Axient.

 

I had personally finished my transition to the platform a few months before the Nexus was announced. Fully expecting I would experience some buyers remorse, a few colleagues and I took SD demo stock out to run tests against my setup. Both systems sounded great, but I personally have to give the edge to Shure in terms of range and remote control. Obviously, external conditions are always a factor, so I wouldn't feel comfortable making any hard declarations. Suffice it to say, I left feeling assured that I had made a good choice for my own needs.

 

The thing that I find enticing about the SD platform is the potential for further development. We've seen this just recently with the extension of the system down into the VHF range. I believe they'll continue to refine their system leading to improved performance and an increase in features. My Shure hardware, on the other hand, is probably locked into it's current feature-set. I'm okay with that (because it's a rich and high performing feature-set), but maybe there will come a time down the road when I look into the SD offerings again... I dunno

 

[Michael Capulli]

1 hour ago, Philip Perkins said:

I'd be interested to know if any sound folks here working in drama or docs are using Axient (or other Shure) these days?  Where I live it is all Lectro, Zax and a few Wisy, with the solo-shooters using low-end Senn G4 or the Blutooth stuff.  I like Shure, but what with diffs in mic connectors etc it's hard to change horses.

 

The Axient system has a lot going for it - I enjoyed using it extensively over a period of two TV seasons. Disadvantages are the receiver rack channel density and they are very power hungry. No real complaints about the talent transmitters once you get used to them- battery telemetry is accurate down to the minute which is refreshing, but unthreading the lemo plug feels like it takes forever! The interface is not as user friendly as Lectro (but if you are running ShowLink you only need to power them up and settings are made on the receiver) Spectrum Manager and the ability to instantly change frequency sounds great in practice - haven't seen it in action too often, and I believe the spectrum manager requires A/C. The newer generation may not, and it is very nice but pricey. My main issue with the spectrum manager is that there is no way to exclude a group of frequencies IE land mobile. In fact I just dealt with this the other day an Axient system was retuning transmitters below 488. I'll also add that the Shure twinplex lavalieres sound great and can really take a beating - comparable to DPA, much more durable than the regulars. I was seeing folks commenting on long wait periods for the Axient stuff FWIW...

Edited August 5, 2023 by Michael Capulli
added some info

[Philip Perkins]

It's crazy that Axient Spectrum Mgr would auto retune into non legal or dangerous bands.  You really can't lock out certain zones?  it seems like that would be important for multistage music fests, theme parks, political conventions etc....

[Michael Capulli]

I would imagine there is a way to do this with Wireless Workbench but as far as I know not on the unit itself. Also the automatic retune feature you only will run with the spectrum manager and is an optional feature not a normal function of axient

[Jeff Wexler]

5 hours ago, tourtelot said:

Come on man.  Take the advertising to Manufacturers and Dealers.  Bad behavior.

 

D.

Doug, your post is bad behavior. I think Glenn was totally within the guidelines of the site and was in direct response to Joe's original post and specifically to the comment from Joe: "Zaxcom clearly answers my needs but sticking with SD for now. 888 user." Glenn was merely pointing out information to help Joe in making decisions by correcting the overall general impression that if you want to go Zaxcom you have to go all Zaxcom. Now if Glenn had done what some other manufacturers have done by claiming "we have the best range" this would not be appropriate. Letting Joe know that there are lots of sound mixers using recorders other than from Zaxcom very successful with Zaxcom wireless equipment.

 

Individuals who are connected to companies that manufacture gear are not relegated to only post in the Manufacturer and Dealers section. For example, Larry Fisher from Lectrosonics has made many posts on the site, some may feel that this was to promote sales, but I always found his posts to be helpful and informative, in the same manner as Glenn's post. 

 

Additionally, if someone in an effort to help Joe had said that Sound Devices wireless only works well with Sound Devices recorders, I would welcome comments from Aaton Cantar to sort the record straight.

[edward chick]

I’ve been using Axient wireless for a year now. Range is good, sound is really good. I like the ability to change freqs from the receiver. You do have to re sync the Show Link after long periods of inactivity. The AD1x transmitters are a little big. But I’m mostly Network news or sit down interviews for sports docs. For commercials or corporate depending on the wardrobe I’ll use the Shures or Lectro sMV.

 

I still rock my Lectro 411as and SR series as well. A good friend and fellow mixer was using the Shure Axient series and raved about them so I bought a set. I had adapters made to from tA5f t Lemo for the transmitters. It’s cheaper than having multiple mics wired for the other transmitters (Lectrosonics).

 

There is a lot of cool wireless out there now. You have to look at what your production workload is requiring and plan it accordingly.

I’m mostly network news and sports docs with a smattering of corporate image and commercials. 

[tourtelot]

Gotta disagree Jeff.  This is on-going and clearly advertising and marketing specifically NOT ALLOWED in these threads.  Just my opinion of course, just like almost everything else on this blog.  

 

But I will probably speak out whenever it occurs.

 

Oh and BTW, Larry's posts are much less blatant and do more serve to provide informantion and not so much to sell goods.  Again, just my opinion.  I'm outie.

 

D.

[Jeff Wexler]

12 hours ago, tourtelot said:

Gotta disagree Jeff.  This is on-going and clearly advertising and marketing specifically NOT ALLOWED in these threads.  Just my opinion of course, just like almost everything else on this blog.  

 

But I will probably speak out whenever it occurs.

 

Oh and BTW, Larry's posts are much less blatant and do more serve to provide informantion and not so much to sell goods.  Again, just my opinion.  I'm outie.

 

D.

I don't entirely disagree with you ...  Glenn's post was certainly borderline as regarding advertising or not. At the very least a bit opportunistic, I will give you that. For me personally, I was pleased to see this widespread misconception about Zaxcom that you have to go ALL Zaxcom to use any of Zaxcom's gear. What does still remain to be true is that if you are all Zaxcom you will have the best integration of wireless, recording, remote control, IFB, an extremely high level of integration and functionality difficult or impossible utilizing gear from several different companies.

[IronFilm]

On 8/5/2023 at 11:23 PM, Jon Mendel Sound said:

Hey all. First time poster, long time reader! I've always used FB channels for communication but figured I'd get on here finally. For my first post I wanted to ask if anyone had keen opinions if you were starting over with new wireless what would you get? (but still using SD 8 series mixers)

 

If I was starting over today, I think I'd still go with exactly what I have right now!

Sony DWX Digital Wireless booms, while buying secondhand Lectrosonics Digital Hybrids bodypacks for the talent. 

As when it comes to performance to price ratio, I think this is a combo that's impossible to beat. 

 

If I was buying all brand new though, I probably wouldn't go with Lectrosonics for the bodypacks. I'd want to carefully do a shoot out between Sony and Shure, and use both extensively in the field before deciding to go all in with one system or the other. For instance comparing the Sony DWT-B03R head to head against the Shure ADX1M, to see which I'd prefer. 

 

However, things are always changing. I watched a video recently where someone from Lectrosonics hinted they'll be coming with remote control features too (that is  not tweedle tones) in the future? Plus I'm sure eventually Shure will release their "AX3" (the lack of it, was one factor as to why I went with Sony DWX instead). 

 

And probably one or more of Shure/Sony/etc will eventually bring out smaller transmitters on par with the Lectrosonics DBSM (or even SSM!). 

 

On 8/5/2023 at 11:23 PM, Jon Mendel Sound said:

I wish to have digital RF, AES output, and remote control on the tx. Since I am an SD user, this leaves Shure or SD. Zaxcom clearly answers my needs but sticking with SD for now. 888 user. 

Sony DWX Digital Wireless is another option here as well as Shure Axient Digital / Sound Devices Wireless. 

And while Shure Axient Digital is the cheapest system to buy a couple of channels of, if you want the remote control feature (i.e. you have to get the ADX1, can't go with the cheaper and bulkier AD1) then Sony sneaks ahead as a cheaper option: 

https://daleproaudio.com/collections/shop?fbclid=IwAR0ujss4SJFXIMnokrojxTEPvIklidbkiWwT0QfAPv8cxOIXmqhZCfBlstA&q=sony dwx#/filter:ss_price:1000:1500/filter:ss_price:1500:2000/filter:ss_price:2000:* (if that is, price is a major factor here to consider) 

  

On 8/6/2023 at 7:39 AM, glenn said:

Zaxcom is a leader in Sales of Digital wireless.

Highly doubtful about this. You're surely underestimating the amount of annual world wide sales by Shure Axient Digital. (for instance, any major live performance is almost never going be Zaxcom, but will likely be Shure or Sennheiser)
Wouldn't even surprise me if Zaxcom doesn't come in as second place, as Sony might sell enough of their Sony DWX systems to venue installations, news crews, and cameramen to take 2nd place. Certainly when compare the volume of ebay listings for Zaxcom vs Sony then there isn't much difference in volume. (however, wouldn't surprise me even if it is yet someone else in 2nd place... perhaps Sennheiser 6000 digital wireless instead, tonnes of places out there have dozens of channels in usage)

[Derek H]

It’s time someone do a serious head to head to head with Nexus, Axient, Zaxcom, and maybe Sony. Something similar to the antenna shootout 695 did years ago. 

 

Zaxcom is a very polarizing brand for a lot of people but you do have to give credit where credit is due. They really have been making digital wireless for waay longer than anyone else. It’s funny to read people gushing about being able to change frequencies from the receiver. That’s been possible with Zaxcom stuff for over a decade! I’m sure Glenn goes a little nuts every time he reads about It. 

[IronFilm]

14 minutes ago, Derek H said:

They really have been making digital wireless for waay longer than anyone else.

Not really, Zaxcom was only a few short years earlier to market than Sony was. (which was in the mid 2000's)

 

14 minutes ago, Derek H said:

That’s been possible with Zaxcom stuff for over a decade!

Same is true once again with Sony, they've been doing this for over a decade as well with remote control over the transmitters. 

And just in general, Sony has been making wireless for longer! (well over half a century. And have been making pro audio equipment since 1950)

[The Documentary Sound Guy]

On 8/5/2023 at 4:23 AM, Jon Mendel Sound said:

Hey all. First time poster, long time reader! I've always used FB channels for communication but figured I'd get on here finally. For my first post I wanted to ask if anyone had keen opinions if you were starting over with new wireless what would you get? (but still using SD 8 series mixers)

I literally faced this choice a month ago as I had to replace about 2/3 of my kit due to a theft.  But in my case, I also had to replace my recorder.

For what it's worth, I ended up choosing Zaxcom.  Ask me in a year if it was the right choice, but for now I'm excited and my first impression is that it's a significant upgrade from my previous Lectros.

I spent a LONG time researching, and I assumed I would end up with SD A20s or I would re-buy Lectro Digital Hybrid.  To my surprise, a feature-for-feature comparison of what I needed favoured Zaxcom as both the cheapest and the best workflow.  The infamous Zaxcom integration translates into quite a bit of saved money in accessories and cables that aren't needed.  That in turn translates into a smaller, lighter bag that consumes less power (and the equipment I do keep in the bag is already smaller and more efficient than an SD rig).  The digital signal is certainly cleaner and better sounding than my Lectros (not that Lectros are bad), and the remote integration that lets me control everything from the Nova is brilliant.

I know from hard experience that Zaxcom isn't always the smoothest experience in terms of interface and bugs, and I was worried I would run into software issues, but both the software and build quality is better than my previous Zaxcom experience.

It's still early, and I haven't truly put the equipment through its paces.  My main uncertainties revolve around range / wireless dropout and Zaxnet reliability.  These I haven't truly tested, so we'll see how it performs when the circumstances get tough.  But, for now I'm happy with what I've got.

[codyman]

1 minute ago, IronFilm said:

Same is true once again with Sony, they've been doing this for over a decade as well. 

And just in general, Sony has been making wireless for longer! (well over half a century. And have been making pro audio equipment since 1950)

You don't really see a lot of Sony out in the field here (at least in Los Angeles) for whatever reason.  I'm assuming it's more popular on your side of the Pacific?  Ironically, I bought my first six channels of Lectro used from a mixer in New Zealand.