johnpaul215 Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 JP: " on non-union indies would be: bring concerns to the shop steward, " oxymoron, shop seward implies a union comntract... Even non-union films usually have one, they always do in my experience. Maybe it doesn't carry the same weight, but they exist. It just makes the normal mundane things easier for there to be one point of contact. Even things like "Hey, can we get fruit at crafty instead of 100% candy bars" are easier when one crew member collects those things and goes to production. When it comes to turnaround or safety, they start the talk that might expand to department heads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Blankenship Posted February 14, 2014 Report Share Posted February 14, 2014 A word of caution: When issues arise, it's often the easy route to assume an adversarial position as the defensive nature of human beings seems somewhat wired that way. However, in most instances, your best course of action is to assume that the parties you're dealing with are well-meaning and reasonable people. Prior to anything approaching an ultimatum, it's good policy to address issues in a cooperative spirit. This is no truer anywhere than on low budget independent films. Most emerging filmmakers are well-intentioned, even if in over their heads. Sometimes a simple, "That's too dangerous" can be sufficient to get their consideration. Other times it might take a friendly reminder that, if the act can be deemed negligent, they could be held personally liable, both legally and financially. While there are some miscreants who are committed to acting like total jerks, I've found those to be few and far between. Most people are decent (in varying degrees, of course). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Karlsson Posted February 15, 2014 Report Share Posted February 15, 2014 I'll try to be more diligent about the gigs that I take, even if it means less income (and more stress for my family who already looks down on my career path). Godspeed. I have found that productions that pay better, usually know how to go about doing things better in general. Planning, safety, food etc. A word of caution: When issues arise, it's often the easy route to assume an adversarial position as the defensive nature of human beings seems somewhat wired that way. However, in most instances, your best course of action is to assume that the parties you're dealing with are well-meaning and reasonable people. Prior to anything approaching an ultimatum, it's good policy to address issues in a cooperative spirit. This is no truer anywhere than on low budget independent films. Most emerging filmmakers are well-intentioned, even if in over their heads. Sometimes a simple, "That's too dangerous" can be sufficient to get their consideration. Other times it might take a friendly reminder that, if the act can be deemed negligent, they could be held personally liable, both legally and financially. While there are some miscreants who are committed to acting like total jerks, I've found those to be few and far between. Most people are decent (in varying degrees, of course). +1 on everything JB says. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bralleput Posted February 15, 2014 Report Share Posted February 15, 2014 Guess the Boom op was shocked as well: In the .Gif (not the actual 'shot'?) the boom was in 3 times... +1 on all said above. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Feeley Posted February 15, 2014 Report Share Posted February 15, 2014 Guess the Boom op was shocked as well: In the .Gif (not the actual 'shot'?) the boom was in 3 times... +1 on all said above. David I read that the video came from a GoPro mounted on top of the main camera. So framing probably isn't exactly what the main camera was getting. As for responding to situations like this, I find a non-confrontational approach usually works. I'm no expert, but I still lean on what I learned by reading Getting to YES, a short book that still sells consistently (and for good reason). Take it away Wikipedia: ==== The method of principled negotiation is based on five propositions:[5] "Separate the people from the problem" "Focus on interests, not positions" "Invent options for mutual gain" "Insist on using objective criteria" "Know your BATNA (Best Alternative To Negotiated Agreement)" ==== http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Getting_to_YES http://www.amazon.com/Getting-Yes-Negotiating-Agreement-Without/dp/0395631246 Summary of the book: http://www.colorado.edu/conflict/peace/example/fish7513.htm Sure, some of the advice is obvious. And some is hard to follow in the heat of the moment. And it doesn't work in all situations. And there are probably plenty of other books and methods. But this one seems to work pretty well. And as others have said, walking away is better than not walking when there's a high risk of injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel Posted February 15, 2014 Report Share Posted February 15, 2014 Negotiation?! No one here has mentioned the risk assessment. Their risk assessment. Your risk assessment of their risk assessment. And your rolling risk assessment of what is going on as it's happening. Assuming their risk assessment looks thorough enough (in this case it should have included a named, professional explosives expert listed as present on set and part of the process). As soon as what is happening departs from the risk assessment given to you by production, something any employer (in this context) is legally obliged to do, your own risk assessment should be production are at best incompetent and and worse criminally negligent. If you want to stay around a minute longer than it takes to pack up and go, take your phone out, make a photo or video and go to the police. Jokers calling themselves producers and risking people's lives need to be shut down, not just for the day or the shoot but permanently. Where the F**K did this piece of crap get hold of explosives? Who the F**K was the explosives expert on set? Who here would feel ok about walking from a shoot to find out later someone (probably younger and less experienced) was seriously hurt or worse, when you might have been able to do something to stop it from happening? dan. fyi: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1792652/?ref_=nv_sr_1#producer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpaul215 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 I guess narrative is different. Generally, when I have worked for a British production company (on US soil) they are very conscious of health&safety. I've done some hairy shows, but they took as much precaution as possible. They flew people in to have crew meetings, we all knew we could email higher ups with any concerns, and they would individually check in with us as the series went on. we were all individually fit for bulletproof vests, we all had the lawyer's phone number in out cellphones in case we got picked up or something. This was the job that sent gear and said "if things really go off the rails, drop that F900 and sound kit and run. It's insured and so is the rental car". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProSound Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Generally, when I have worked for a British production company (on US soil) they are very conscious of health&safety. I've done some hairy shows, but they took as much precaution as possible. +1 I have had same experience very safety conscious and very willing to discuss any concerns. they also seem to be better insured usually too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studiomprd Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Omaha: " and the willingness to pay for all of that... " not necessarily... though doing things safely may incur more costs, I've also been on low budget shoots where an excellent, qualified, and experienced pyro person was working as a personal favor (thus free)... strei: " It literally got worse each production day -- all the way up to the last two production days " that shouldn't have happened, perhaps as the crew continued to tolerate unsafe conditions, the production got bolder..? When you stayed, you became part of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Thomas Posted February 17, 2014 Report Share Posted February 17, 2014 On a national paper's website now:http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/watch-actress-blown-up-during-3154970#.UwJWOgfPFps.facebook looks like they're not too fussed about the copyright takedown notices Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Ragon Posted February 17, 2014 Report Share Posted February 17, 2014 I wasn't going to post anything about this, as I've been following it on Reddit for a while now.. Just another scumbag production company taking advantage of newbies thinking they are getting into 'the biz'. But.. I'm amazed at how fast the production can take down all the sites reporting on it. This alarms me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrider Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 ...And a few days after this discussion, we have a tragedy in Georgia. All the facts aren't in yet, but from what we know a disregard for basic safety procedures resulted in a loss of life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Davies Amps CAS Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 Remember the Six P Rule. Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Perfomance!! Malcolm Davies. A.m.p.s. CAS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Davies Amps CAS Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 On a much lighter note I was doing a movie in Lithuania and the American SFX had a couple of t-shirts. The first one said f***k the dialogue lets blow something up. The second said: I'm the guy that blows things up. If you see me running try and keep up. One day they were blowing up a cottage which they had filled with bags of petrol. I asked the F X supervisor if my position with my cart was in a safe area, perfectly OK he said. When the bang went off I saw a ball of fire heading straight towards me. My boom- Op saw the fireball, looked towards the cart and was just in time to see a pair of headphones in mid-air, but I had gone. Malcolm Davies. A.m.p.s. CAS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afewmoreyears Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 Similar story..... 1983 I think.... I was holding a boom pole in the desert.... they were blowing up a vehicle with two guys running from it.... First take went well, then the director said, a little bigger on the explosion please..... we were re positioned a bit further back... When the new take started, all seemed normal.... and then the blast... it was like 10 times as big.... I felt a hot flash, dropped the boom ( I was already lying down) and felt my face to see if it was still there... eyelashes, brows etc.... All was OK but it was a learning experience.. for sure.... 1) when the special effects person is missing many fingers.... beware.... 2) when they say a little bigger, it means a LOT bigger.... Every time something is going to be blown up, I remember that day..... every time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old school Posted March 2, 2014 Report Share Posted March 2, 2014 A Director asking for a take 2 on an explosion is always a mistake in my experience. CrewC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasmus Wedin Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Is there a way to see the video anywhere? Seems to be taken down everywhere I checked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrd456 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 I used to work with a pyro guy a lot called Three Fingered Harry----several times he performed true to his name.Some of you may remember him from working in the 1970's. J.D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afewmoreyears Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 My guy was "Rodger..... " I am sure many of you remember him... also an old timer... also missing fingers.. LA based... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old school Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 My favorite guy was a German with missing fingers and an eye patch. Can't remember his name, can't forget his face. CrewC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjafreddan Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Is there a way to see the video anywhere? Seems to be taken down everywhere I checked. Try this link: http://jonoo.chickenkiller.com/ Complete madness in terms of safety thinking! Kudos to the lady in the picture, she's really brave standing in front of a "planned" explosion. Fred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasmus Wedin Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wielage Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 A Director asking for a take 2 on an explosion is always a mistake in my experience. Famously, that was what happened on the Twilight Zone shoot with John Landis. Many, many mistakes made on that shoot, and no less than two full-length books were written on the incident and the resultant trial. I thought of that quite a bit after the Sarah Jones incident came to light a week or two ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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